| “Rtvik: Proof positive in one sentence: Srila Prabhupada stated on May 28, 1977 that all future initiations within ISKCON, including after he departed from this material world, would be via rtvik, and 42 days later, on July 9th, he clarified this in writing by stating 3 times that the devotees initiated by the ‘rtvik representatives of the Acarya’ would be his disciples, not the disciples of the Rtviks.” |

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Rtvik: Proof positive in One Short Web Page

by Pratyatosa Dasa, July 24, 2016

Srila Prabhupada’s prescription for future initiations within ISKCON is via “Rtvik representatives of the Acarya.” It doesn’t take an entire book to prove this. This relatively short, one-page website is more than sufficient:

1. What was Srila Prabhupada’s definition of the word, “henceforward?”

2. How did Srila Prabhupada answer when asked about future initiations within ISKCON after his physical departure?

3. What was Srila Prabhupada’s formal, written, signed document in response to this same question?

4. Does Srila Prabhupada’s Declaration of Will give further evidence about his desire for future initiations within ISKCON?

5. What about the “… in his absence or disappearance you can accept disciples without any limitation” argument?

6. Rtvik: Proof positive in one sentence.

1. What was Srila Prabhupada’s definition of the word, “henceforward?”:

The following is Srila Prabhupada’s final, written, signed order on Sanskrit diacritics. As usual, it’s crystal-clear and doesn’t leave any room for speculation and/or interpretation by the “intellectual class.”

Prabhupada: In reply to Jayadvaita’s questions, henceforward the policy for using diacritic markings is that I want them used everywhere, on large books, small books and also BTG. If there is any difficulty with the pronunciation, then after the correct diacritic spelling, in brackets the words “pronounced as _,” may be written. So even on covers the diacritic markings should be used. We should not have to reduce our standard on account of the ignorant masses. Diacritic spelling is accepted internationally, and no learned person will even care to read our books unless this system is maintained. (Letter to Jadurani, 31 December, 1971)

Here, it’s obvious that Srila Prabhupada’s definition of the word “henceforward” is the same as the dictionary definition:

henceforward - from this time forth; from now on

Obviously, the GBC and the BBT Trustees understood this directive to mean the dictionary definition, because they didn’t suddenly stop using Sanskrit diacritics in Srila Prabhupada’s books and in BTG magazine after Srila Prabhupada’s physical departure!

2. How did Srila Prabhupada answer when asked about future initiations within ISKCON after his physical departure?:

The ISKCON GBC meets with Srila Prabhupada in Vrndavana, India on May 28, 1977:

Satsvarupa Maharaja: Then our next question concerns initiations in the future, particularly at that time when you are no longer with us. We want to know how first and second initiations will be conducted.

Srila Prabhupada: Yes. I shall recommend some of you. After this is settled up. I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating acarya.

Tamala Krsna Maharaja: Is that called rtvik-acarya?

Srila Prabhupada: Rtvik. Yes.

Srila Prabhupada never once used the contradictory term, “rtvik acarya.” He did, however, use the confusing term, “officiating acarya” once, but in the July 9, 1977 letter to all GBC men and temple presidents, he changed the terminology to the crystal-clear: “rtvik representative of the Acarya.” (See point #3 below.)

The rest of the conversation seems to indicate that the new initiates would be the disciples of the Rtviks and that they would be Prabhupada’s “grand-disciples,” but, obviously, between May 28 and July 9, 1977 (42 days), Srila Prabhupada changed his mind about the “He’s guru,” the “They’re his disciple,” and the “He is grand disciple” portions of the conversation. (See point #3 below.) Why is this so difficult to understand? Do you think that you can hold the pure devotee hostage to his previous words, and order him to never change his mind? We are servants, not masters!

3. What was Srila Prabhupada’s formal, written, signed document in response to this same question?:

“I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating acarya” was done by Srila Prabhupada in the form of a formal, signed document: the letter to all members of the GBC body and to all temple presidents dated July 9, 1977. It is perfectly clear to anyone who is not self-motivated: “Rtvik henceforward!” (paraphrased). The letter also makes it perfectly clear that the disciples initiated by the “rtvik representatives of the Acarya” would be Prabhupada’s disciples, not the disciples of the Rtviks. In fact, this point was made 3 times! But the demons within ISKCON try to belittle this all-important directive by saying, “It’s a letter written by Tamal Krishna.” Or they try to make Prabhupada’s own terminology, “rtvik,” into a dirty word by making a sour face whenever they say it! (For those of you who are concerned about the parampara (disciplic succession) ending with Prabhupada, please note that there is no prohibition on becoming a diksa guru outside of ISKCON. Therefore, his disciples are free to follow his perfect example: To start their own institutions and to become the diksa gurus of those institutions.)

4. Does Srila Prabhupada’s Declaration of Will give further evidence about his desire for future initiations within ISKCON?:

Yes! Srila Prabhupada’s will states that “The system of management will continue as it is now and there is no need of any change.” My question is, “Since a will, by definition, goes into effect immediately after a person leaves his material body, why were changes made to the system of initiations immediately after Srila Prabhupada’s physical departure? Also, his will states, “…a successor director or directors may be appointed by the remaining directors, provided the new director is my initiated disciple…” My question is, “How can the property directors always be, in the future, ‘my initiated disciples,’ unless Srila Prabhupada’s system of rtvik initiations is continued now and in the future?”

5. What about the “… in his absence or disappearance you can accept disciples without any limitation” argument?:

Srila Prabhupada always kept who got 1st and 2nd initiation and when he or she got it under the strict control of himself, the GBC representatives, and the temple presidents. Why should today be any different? (a) “From Madhavananda I have heard that there is some worship of yourself by the other devotees. Of course it is proper to offer obeisances to a Vaisnava, but not in the presence of the spiritual master. After the departure of the spiritual master, it will come to that stage, but now wait. Otherwise it will create factions.” (b) “I will never die. … I shall live forever in my books …” (c) “He reasons ill that Vaisnavas die ….” Therefore, we shouldn’t think that, within Srila Prabhupada’s own institution, we can accept disciples on our own behalf. Lord Sri Krsna obviously tricked the “guru wannabes” by instructing Srila Prabhupada to write what he did in (a) above. Also, in that same letter, Srila Prabhupada stated very clearly that having more than one guru at a time within ISKCON creates factions, which is something that he does not want. Yet certain self-motivated rascals have the audacity to use this letter as evidence that Prabhupada sanctioned the GBC’s concocted, ever-changing voted-in guru system! Since Srila Prabhupada is eternally present in his books, and especially in his beloved ISKCON, we are therefore prohibited, by points (a) through (c) above, from, at least within ISKCON, taking on disciples on our own behalf. Prabhupada created ISKCON for his own disciples, not for the disciples of others.

Another explanation of statement (a) above, an explanation which would stand up in any court of law, is that Srila Prabhupada changed his mind. Even if one takes this statement as a license for becoming an initiating spiritual master (diksa-guru) within ISKCON, it was obviously superseded by the July 9th “Rtvik henceforward!” order. (See point #3 above.)

6. Rtvik: Proof positive in one sentence:

Srila Prabhupada stated on May 28, 1977 that all future initiations within ISKCON, including after he departed from this material world, would be via rtvik, and 42 days later, on July 9th, he clarified this in writing by stating 3 times that the devotees initiated by the “rtvik representatives of the Acarya” would be his disciples, not the disciples of the Rtviks.

What could be more clear than this? Anyone who can’t understand this is a either a fool or a self-motivated rascal!


As disciples and followers of Srila Prabhupada, some things we follow blindly. Some things we do not.

Written, signed, legally viable documents containing Srila Prabhupada’s management decisions for ISKCON, such as the 7/9/77 letter to all GBCs and temple presidents, we follow blindly. This is our duty as disciples and followers of Srila Prabhupada. When Srila Prabhupada gave women the first line of Gayatri Mantra, a policy which is completely unprecedented in the history of Vaisnavism, we all simply accepted it. When Srila Prabhupada made the management decision that his disciples could receive Gayatri Mantra via audio cassette tape, even though such a policy is nowhere to be found in the Vaisnava scriptures (sastra) and is completely unprecedented, we all simply accepted it without question. Why should the July 9th letter be any different? The answer is obvious: Some of Srila Prabhupada’s disciples are afflicted with the “I wanna be a guru like Prabhupada” disease. In other words, they are strongly self-motivated to find some excuse not to accept the July 9th letter on blind faith.

However, to blindly follow everything that Srila Prabhupada says in casual conversations is not what Srila Prabhupada intends for us to do. Srila Prabhupada didn’t want blind followers. He wanted followers who use their God-given intelligence in the service of God (Krsna). We have to learn to use some common sense discrimination.

Speaking of common sense, more than one initiating spiritual master within an organization causes disunity. This has been more than amply demonstrated within ISKCON since 1978!

Some devotees say it’s a matter of “rtvik vs. traditional,” but the Vaisnava tradition is to follow the orders of the guru. Therefore, rtvik is the tradition, and everything else is a concoction!

But all that ISKCON’s self-motivated ritvik-bashers can do is to repeat the same tired, old arguments that were thoroughly defeated in 1996 by the book, THE FINAL ORDER!


My thanks to Visvamitra Prabhu for informing me of the following video from ISKCON Bangalore. Please watch and listen to the highly intelligent, highly educated devotees from South India testifying on behalf of Srila Prabhupada’s rtvik system of initiations. (The volume level is unusually high, so, before playing it, be sure to turn down your computer’s audio level. Also, the audio is slightly out-of-sync with the video, but the message is crystal-clear nonetheless):

http://krishnatube.com/video/63/The-Philosophy-of-ISKCON-Bangalore


Srila Prabhupada’s ingenious rtvik system of initiations will inevitably be reinstated within ISKCON because it is clearly what he prescribed. In fact, the process has already begun. The outstanding success of ISKCON Bangalore is a practical demonstration of how extremely well it works!

Eye Witness Account of Hansadutta Dasa

Hansadutta Dasa is a convincing eye witness to say the least. Not only is he very intelligent and very sincere, but he’s also a former member of the GBC, a former BBT trustee, a former “rtvik representative of the Acarya,” and a former “zonal acarya!” He even has two official letters from Srila Prabhupada’s secretary mentioning his role as a “rtvik representative of the Acarya.”

HANSADUTTA: “I distinctly remember when I received the July 9, 1977, letter in Sri Lanka that it was clear to me that this letter was Srila Prabhupada’s arrangement for initiations for the future. I also remember feeling some disappointment with the obvious conditional authority that the “Ritvik representative of the Acharya” designation implied, because I actually had a great desire to be a Guru like Srila Prabhupada, and I think many of the leaders did have similar desires. Still, I understood it was a very responsible and authoritative appointment.” (http://hansadutta.com/ART_ NAMHATTA/prown-field.html)

HANSADUTTA: “On July 10th [1977] I received another letter from Srila Prabhupada written in response to a letter I had sent him describing the preaching activities in Sri Lanka at that time. In this letter he wrote as follows:

“‘You are a suitable person and you can give initiation to those that are ready for it. I have selected you among eleven men as Ritvik representative of the Acharya, to give initiations, both first and second initiation, on my behalf… Those who are initiated are [my] disciples, and anyone who you deem fit and initiate in this way, you should send their names to be included in [my] Initiated Disciples book.’

“I immediately wrote a letter to Srila Prabhupada asking him why he had been so merciful towards me by appointing me as his ‘Ritvik representative of the Acharya’ which I understood to be a very confidential and responsible position. In other words, it was clear to me that this letter appointing ‘Ritvik Representatives’ to initiate new disciples on Srila Prabhupada’s behalf was Srila Prabhupada’s final instructions in anticipation of his disappearance from the world.”

The May 28, 1977 Conversation Tape

From <http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=34065#comment-15222>:

mark says:
12 February 2013 at 12:05 am

In 1997, the entire 22 minutes of the May 28th tape was analyzed by Norman Perle. That person said there were “strong signs suggestive of falsification.”

On April 15, 2012, a devotee named Giri Nayaka das performed an analysis on the audio recording which we all had access to on the Prabhupada vision website. His equipment was far more sensitive, and he was much better a judge than Norman Perle as to whether words were in context as Norman Perle had no reference to the philosophy. In addition, Giri Nayaka das gave us detailed analysis and results of each minute of recording, and showed that the sections of the tape that Norman Perle found “start/stops” that seemed out of place were NOT from the 2 minutes under discussion here.

May 28th Tape Analysis, Giri-nayaka das, Slovenia:

Previous forensics analysis from August 26, 1997 did the following: “The analysis procedure included computer waveform analysis, spectrographic chart analysis, FFT spectrum frequency analysis and a critical aural review of the audio.”

The following analysis gives more in depth analysis. It includes before used methods, namely:

- computer waveform analysis,
- spectrographic chart analysis,
- FFT spectrum frequency analysis and a
- critical aural review of the audio,

…and in addition includes other methods, namely:
- ambient analysis
- positional analysis
- spectral phase analysis

Let me also add that I, author of this analysis, am well acquainted with Srila Prabhupada’s way of speaking, through years of hearing his recordings. I’m also well acquainted with the way Srila Prabhupada’s recorded tapes sound, them being recorded on tape machine, which was following Srila Prabhupada from day to day. [The] official forensic from 1997 had no such benefit…


You can read his full analysis at the following link.

http://prabhupadavision.com/2012/04/may-28th-tape-analysis/

Two weeks later on April 27, [2012, Kesava Dasa reprinted Norman Perle’s original 1997 analysis].

http://prabhupadavision.com/2012/04/tape-original-analysis/

In the comments section, Giri Nayaka das carefully explained with FURTHER detailed analysis how Norman Perle’s analysis was not only inconclusive, but couldn’t possibly relate to the 2 minute portion where officiating acaryas are spoken of.

Anyone with an objective conscience must agree after listening to the audio, and viewing Giri’s detailed results, the 2 minute portion was not tampered with.

As for the interpretation of what it means, there appear to be many according to the opinion of the translator, including myself. So be it.

I consider the June conversation in which Srila Prabhupada begins to name Ritviks that he would later put in the July letter, another example of why Srila Prabhupada said what he said on May 28th. As you can see, [Tamal Krsna das Goswami] continues to “remind” Srila Prabhupada that the new initiates are Srila Prabhupada’s disciples, hoping beyond hope that Srila Prabhupada will change his mind and correct him at some point, or perhaps trip up. LOL.

Like I said in my last post, FOR MY PURPOSES the July 9th letter stands alone and needs no qualification. For the purposes of debating those who wish to drag the May 28th conversation into the mix, I have no problem allowing that Srila Prabhupada was deftly giving a NON CONCESSION by equating officiating acaryas with gurus, using a Jedi mind trick to keep a carrot dangled in front of the crazed lunatics who stood before him.

The July 9, 1977 Directive

From <http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=32440#comment-13807>:

mark says:
13 January 2013 at 12:06 am

SG wrote: Bhakta Hugh, the problem with the July 9th letter is that it does not say that the rtvik initiation performed on behalf of Srila Prabhupada must continue after his departure from this planet. There is nothing specifically written to that effect.

SG, you would lose in a debate to a high school student who had read introduction to Logic in his after-school debate club.

The system had been in place for years. By July of 1977 that system was completely worked out. The July 9th letter outlined and documented that system according to all the latest procedures which had evolved over those years. It also assigned the official title to the positions already held in the rtvik initiation framework.

When such a policy directive is issued, without mentioning a time limit, and even utilizing the adverb henceforward, the burden of proof is on YOU to show any directive which sets a time limit.

And to quote your words, “there is nothing written to that effect.” Provide it you cannot, thus you [would] lose any debate before it even started.

There was, and is, NOTHING in the rtvik initiation procedure as outlined in that policy directive which could not continue when Srila Prabhupada’s atma left the planet. That is a fact. After all, he and LORD KRSNA (WHO, BY THE WAY, DICTATED THAT SYSTEM) arranged the system to act perfectly without Srila Prabhupada’s bodily input.

Gee ya think there might have been a reason?

Simple for the simple.

Of course those who wish to take advantage of Srila Prabhupada’s intellectual and physical properties for their own selfish purposes have a terrible time accepting the fact that there was no arrangement for them to step in and become the exclusive successor gurus/acaryas/spiritual masters of future candidates for discipleship.

From your writings I count you as such a dreamer. Dream on, pal.

The “Officiating Acarya” Confusion

From <http://www.prabhupadanugas.eu/news/?p=32215#comment-13333>:

Pratyatosa Dasa (ACBSP) says:
31 December 2012 at 5:38 pm

Bhakta Hugh says: Srila Prabhupada does NOT state that the Rtvik (officiating acarya) will have disciples.

No. Not “officiating acarya!” Srila Prabhupada only used that terminology once and he never put it in writing. He obviously changed his mind about using that terminology. The improved terminology that he, later on, actually put in writing several times is “ritvik representative of the Acarya (Srila Prabhupada),” which is much more clear, easier to understand, and less subject to interpretation by self-motivated rascals.

I may say many things to you, but when I say something directly, “Do it,” your first duty is to do that. You cannot argue, “Sir, you said me like this before.” No, that is not your duty. What I say now, you do it. That is obedience. (Srila Prabhupada, April 15, 1975)

If the captain of the ship says “5 degrees starboard” and the first mate replies, “But captain, before you told me ‘10 degrees port,’” then it can be understood that the first mate has gone insane. (From point #1 of http://pratyatosa.com/?P=27 - “Sixteen Points to Consider Regarding the Ritvik Issue”)

[Krsna consciousness] is simple for the simple, but it is very hard for the crooked. (Srila Prabhupada, December 26, 1969)

Unlike Srila Prabhupada’s “crooked” so-called followers, his “simple” followers are not confused by things that he said prior to his July 9, 1977 directive to all GBC men/temple presidents. Srila Prabhupada is allowed to change his mind! We cannot hold him hostage to the things that he said prior to changing his mind! To do so is rascaldom!

TKG Came Up with the Word “Rtvik” on His Own?

January 29, 2012:

Dear Prabhus, Hare Krsna! Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

I’ve heard yet another objection to this website. It actually amazes me that some of my godbrothers are so unbelievably self-motivated that they could think this way: “Tamal Krsna Gosvami came up with the word “rtvik” on his own, and Srila Prabhupada, for some unknown reason, went along with it.” How any of my godbrothers could think in this naive, offensive way is beyond me!

Srila Prabhupada would never, in a million years, simply “go along” with terminology which would deeply affect the future of ISKCON! First and second initiation were the most important part of the ingenious management system that Srila Prabhupada implemented within ISKCON. It gave the local temple presidents the power that they needed in order to manage effectively. The way that it worked was as follows: “If the temple president said you got initiated, then you got initiated, otherwise not!” It was as simple as that. No if’s, and’s, or but’s!

The actual explanation for TKG’s initial use of the term is very simple: “Srila Prabhupada had been using the term “rtvik” in unrecorded, unreported conversations prior to the time that TKG mentioned it in the May 28, 1977 conversation.” This is the obvious explanation for anyone who is not self-motivated. (Someone who is not afflicted with the “I wanna be a guru like Prabhupada” disease.)

[Krsna consciousness] is simple for the simple, but it is very hard for the crooked. (Initiation lecture, Boston, December 26, 1969)

Your servant, Pratyatosa Dasa

Srila Prabhupada Left Things Unclear?

September 19, 2011:

Dear Prabhus, Hare Krsna! Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!

So far, the only objection that I’ve heard to this one-page website is that “Srila Prabhupada left things unclear.” This is extremely offensive to Srila Prabhupada! What the objector is saying, in effect, is that “Srila Prabhupada was irresponsible.” How initiations were to be carried out for the future of ISKCON is simply a management decision. There is no mysterious hocus-pocus involved whatsoever. All of the mysterious hocus-pocus is being carried out by Lord Sri Krsna behind the scenes.

Srila Prabhupada always made important management decisions regarding his beloved ISKCON in the form of signed, written documents, such as the July 9, 1977 letter to all GBC men/temple presidents. As usual, it’s crystal-clear and doesn’t leave any room for the mental masturbations of the “intellectual class” rascals. Whenever Srila Prabhupada made such a decision, none of his disciples ever dared to say, “Wait, Srila Prabhupada, we have to research whether or not that decision is bona fide!”

So, why do they dare to say such things now? Obviously, they are envious, self-motivated, “I wanna be a guru like Prabhupada” rascals who think, “Prabhupada is dead and gone so now I can do whatever I want.” IMHO, they are atheistic demons who don’t even believe in the law of karma!

[Krsna consciousness] is simple for the simple, but it is very hard for the crooked. (Initiation lecture, Boston, December 26, 1969)

Your servant, Pratyatosa Dasa

Questions, comments and suggestions are welcome.
Pratyatosa Dasa ()

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